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July 22, 2005



I wuz surprised that Juana, my honey, didn't mention "stuff on a stick" -- you know any craft item on a stick that you stick in your lawn or flowerbeds. I say craft because for the most part I see nothing artistic about it. Yes there are some nice pieces done in say copper with a plasma cutter. Art? I think not, but nice none the less.

This whole thing would never occured to me if my sister wasn't an artist, and long time member of the Artist's Guild in Ann Arbor. She's tried many different art forms from painting to miniatures. She started doing beautiful stained glass and then incorporated wood into her pieces. She's done some beautiful ceramic pieces on her pottery wheel and *none* of it would sell at an art fair. What's an artist to do? Make stuff on a stick!

If you go to an art fair, watch the people who are leaving. How many of them have "art on a stick" in their hands?

My sister didn't stoop to that. She is making some wonderful ceramic mosaic tiles. But I wonder if she'd make "art on a stick" if she...?



Hey, Jude and i tried brainstorming stuff-on-a-stick, but it turned morbid pretty quickly!

Took  Gallagher

Man! There is a LOT of stuff in that posting!

But I'm only going to whine about ACEO/eBay art.

Some people (ME, mostly) are very limited in our/my artistic abilities...some people are actual artists (YOU, let's say).

While eBay is not my exact idea of what I want to be doing with my "art", it IS providing me with an outlet to sell a few things here and there...and not have to deal with people face to face looking at and handling my stuff with no intention of buying it...stick or no stick. (HEY -- collaged sticks!) LOL

I agree wholeheartedly that a lot (okay, MOST) of the categories/words/whatever that you use on eBay ARE a sales pitch...but if saying that I am "an outsider artist making mixed media collages" causes someone to look at my silly little decorated playing card -- COOL! Do I BELIEVE I'm an Outsider Artist (note capitals) -- of COURSE NOT! And ACEOs? Heck, I will ride it as long as I can. Does it make me FEEL like an artist? Kinda. Do I think I AM an artist? Hell no!

I didn't go to school for any art training. I didn't have to listen to teachers criticize my stuff or put up with classmates and attitudes and all that. I haven't been in collectives, or sat gallery shows. I have never been to the Ann Arbor Art Fair (and I am sure I never ACTUALLY want to go)...you, on the other hand, have been there/done that.

For me, personally, my "art" on eBay gives me something to do...and I get to stay in my pajamas all day. I am far from PROUD about being an eBay "artist" -- kinda like being an MTV Headbangers Ball "big hair" band vs Motorhead...but what the heck...we can't ALL be REAL artists...

took  Gallagher

P.S. -- and just so you know...

I honestly did not take anything personally in the post. I am NOT defending ACEOs or eBay art...

I'm just sayin'!



i don't think (at least i hope) that this was the best post of my life, so maybe you didn't get my point. i'll be more direct. Art is what the artist, the maker of the thing, says it is. Artists are artists if they say they are. i can like or not like it, but if the 'artist' calls it art, i'm with them. We've discussed this personally before, but i don't think (judging from what you just wrote) that you grasp that everyone can do some things, and no one can do everything. Your comment implies my resources and abilities are so vast that i can be, do or sell anything on eBay or anywhere else, but i know such is not he case. My post, and to me the issue, was about how art and artists are or should be defined, and who does that. i said the artist. And your response to one sentence of my post indicates that's a concern for you as well.

But let's be clear on which one of us is saying you're not a 'real' artist. It's not me. i was speaking for myself. Me. i love Gus Fink, but if i tried to do what he does, my work would turn to shit in two shakes of a lamb's tail. Good or bad, better or worse, has nothing to do with it. Like Popeye, i am what i am.

You do what you do better than i ever could, and you have the potential to excel in some environments, like eBay, where i have a tougher go. i am an outsider artist, and i don't resent in the slightest that some folks might get extra hits because they call themselves one. i might, too, if i thought it would sell a piece, i haven't, because it wasn't relevant to what i've sold on eBay. The label has been rendered meaningless by abuse, but just like 'art' or 'artist', the artist can claim or reject it. Or do whatever works for what you're doing.

You give me too much credit... as an artist (and i know i don't suck), and as a critic of eBay self-representing artists. So why can't you shift some of that credit over to the part where i recognize your artistry, instead of looking for a way to believe i'm capable of invalidating artists on eBay, or anywhere else? Take some of that credit you're giving me, and give it back to yourself, where it belongs!

took  Gallagher

I don't think either one of us "got" what the other was saying the first time through.

All I was saying was that we have different experience and backgrounds and our views come from different angles (or something).

I understand you were simply stating your opinions and so was I.

I said I was just sayin'.



So, did you read Nenslo's post? It was certainly more worthwhile than my post was!

took  Gallagher

Oh, Man!





Oddly, we didn't see too many things-on-sticks at the fair, possibly because that niche has been usurped by Dollar Store items imported from China.

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